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**charlio lemieux** · 06-29-2009, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RStar

Not sure if you could pry Staal away from the Rags for that price. If the trade went through, it would be mainly for the Rangers to dump Drurys contract.

Ya, how badly they want out of that awful deal is the key. Staal is a big loss.

Basically I was thinking they would jump at a Stajan for Drury deal, just to dump the contract. But to make the deal happen the Leafs want Staal for Kaberle and a 3rd. The pick is negotiable. Might throw in Mitchell instead. IF the Rags are happy paying the contract then this don't matter.

**VICE™** · 06-29-2009, 05:11 PM

I think they would try to get rid of Gomez before Drury, but that's just me.

**charlio lemieux** · 06-29-2009, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

I think they would try to get rid of Gomez before Drury, but that's just me.

One or the other, my man.
Just want Staal. The bagage he brings is of no concern.

Getting Staal would give the Leafs a great young trio of defenders. Ian White really came into his own last year. Staal and Schenn would make a decent young shutdown pairing.

How about this doozy?

To OTT:
Kopitar
Goligoski
Frolov

To LAK:
Malkin
Orpik
Dupuis
OTT 1st

To PIT:
Heatley
Brown
J. Johnson
Volchenkov

**cityStatic** · 06-29-2009, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charlio lemieux

One or the other, my man.
Just want Staal. The bagage he brings is of no concern.

Getting Staal would give the Leafs a great young trio of defenders. Ian White really came into his own last year. Staal and Schenn would make a decent young shutdown pairing.

How about this doozy?

To OTT:
Kopitar
Goligoski
Frolov

To LAK:
Malkin
Orpik
Dupuis
OTT 1st
Pit 2nd

To PIT:
Heatley
Brown
J. Johnson
Volchenkov

WTF??????? Heatly, Brown, Johnson, and Volchenkov won't nearly replace Malkin, Dupuis, Orpik, and Goligoski, and who we would draft 2nd!!!!!!1

**VICE™** · 06-29-2009, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Andre Fleury rulz

WTF??????? Heatly, Brown, Johnson, and Volchenkov won't nearly replace Malkin, Dupuis, Orpik, and Goligoski, and who we would draft 2nd!!!!!!1

Uh. The only one that isn't replaceable would be Malkin, and even then Heatley is about as close as you could get.

Brown > Dupuis
Volchenkov > Orpik
Johnson > Goligoski

With that said, I'm not sure the deal works for the three teams Cap-wise. I do agree that there should be a pick headed to Pittsburgh as well though.

**charlio lemieux** · 06-29-2009, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Andre Fleury rulz

WTF??????? Heatly, Brown, Johnson, and Volchenkov won't nearly replace Malkin, Dupuis, Orpik, and Goligoski, and who we would draft 2nd!!!!!!1

Really?

Volchenkov is a good replacement for Orpik.
Johnson is going to be a top 2 D-man, an improvment over Goligoski.
Heatley is a premiere winger for Crosby.
Dupuis is a 4th liner and his cap space is needed.
Brown is the best young power-forward/agitator playing on the wing in the NHL.

Pittsburg makes out quite well in this. Remember they have Staal as their 2nd line center. Put him with Brown or Heatley and they would be dangerous.

**charlio lemieux** · 06-29-2009, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

Uh. The only one that isn't replaceable would be Malkin, and even then Heatley is about as close as you could get.

Brown > Dupuis
Volchenkov > Orpik
Johnson > Goligoski

With that said, I'm not sure the deal works for the three teams Cap-wise. I do agree that there should be a pick headed to Pittsburgh as well though.

It is roughly close to the cap. The only one I didn't really check was LAK, but I figure they have some room.

IT would eat up most of Ottawa's and Pittsburg's cap room.

Say maybe LAK 1st or just drop the Pitt 2nd?

**charlio lemieux** · 06-29-2009, 06:56 PM

After looking at this, if you drop the Pitt 2nd, then there is no loser in this deal.

OTT gets a great 1-2 punch at center, a decent winger, and a decent d-man.
Down side is they may need to move Fisher for help on the wing and to clear some cap space.

PIT gets one of the leagues premiere goal scorers, the top Power-forward/agitator in the game, and two solid d-men, one being a 1st overall pick.
Down side they lose the only one who can replace everythingCrosby brings to the game. imo the better talent of the entire Trio.

LAK get the mega star they need to keep the building full and the TV rating high.
Down side is the only one they will really miss is Brown. Johnson has already been in rumors, and as much as I like him, Kopitar is no comparison to what Malkin brings to the table.

Where's Bure? · 06-30-2009, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charlio lemieux

After looking at this, if you drop the Pitt 2nd, then there is no loser in this deal.

OTT gets a great 1-2 punch at center, a decent winger, and a decent d-man.
Down side is they may need to move Fisher for help on the wing and to clear some cap space.

PIT gets one of the leagues premiere goal scorers, the top Power-forward/agitator in the game, and two solid d-men, one being a 1st overall pick.
Down side they lose the only one who can replace everythingCrosby brings to the game. imo the better talent of the entire Trio.

LAK get the mega star they need to keep the building full and the TV rating high.
Down side is the only one they will really miss is Brown. Johnson has already been in rumors, and as much as I like him, Kopitar is no comparison to what Malkin brings to the table.

Quote:

Originally Posted by charlio lemieux

One or the other, my man.
Just want Staal. The bagage he brings is of no concern.

Getting Staal would give the Leafs a great young trio of defenders. Ian White really came into his own last year. Staal and Schenn would make a decent young shutdown pairing.

How about this doozy?

To OTT:
Kopitar
Goligoski
Frolov

To LAK:
Malkin
Orpik
Dupuis
OTT 1st
Pit 2nd

To PIT:
Heatley
Brown
J. Johnson
Volchenkov

Wow, that is one heck of a trade. Well thought out. Geez, who doesn't that work out for? As a Pit fan I really do see the point of the trade. I love Malkin and it'd be hard to part with him, but he does bring to the table the same attributes as Crosby. And after this year, his value would be at an all-time high, so I think what he brought to the Pens in this trade is warranted – which is A LOT. Brown goes beyond his skill, Johnson is better than Goligoski (although I don't have much fact to base that on), Heatley is elite winger who would challenge Ovechkin for goals on Crosby's line, and Volchenkov is just under Orpik IMO, although if there was another player in the league to replace his style of play he's it.

That being said, I think the 3-headed monster in Pit with Crosby, Malkin, and Staal centering three different lines is a big reason for their success.

But as far as the trade goes, I feel Pit is receiving and giving away fairly even value. Now IMO I don't think Ott gave up enough to get Kopitar, Frolov, and Goligoski and I think the Kings gave up too much in Brown, Kopitar, Frolov, J. Johnson. Heatley wants out, and that leaves Ott's GM with less value than Heatley would normally have – add to that he had a season below his standards. Maybe Ott takes back their 1st, gives back Frolov, and gives a 3rd conditional – both to the Kings.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

Read the whole thread, the whole point is to make an offer they can't refuse.

Why ya gotta break balls? I know it's the offer you can't refuse, but it still should stay remotely reasonable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

Armstrong means a lot to the Thrashers' fanbase and the team itself. He's one of the most popular players that's on the team, sells the second most jerseys behind Kovalchuk, one of the main defensive players on Atlanta (as shown by him being the only one in their top six with a positive +/-) and from Kozlov's mouth itself, he's one of the few leadership guys in the room.

He'd mean less to the Pens, as they have enough "popular" players – Max Talbot and now Bill Guerin. And how hard is it to look like a leader with a team like Atl?

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

Not to mention that he's a 20 goal scorer playing on the second line in Atlanta, and could easily hit 30 or more if he's brought back to Pittsbugh and put back on a line with Crosby.

He never looked like he played that well in the past with Crosby. I know they're friends, but birdman Armstrong never could finish.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAHQALL

He brings a lot of intangibles to whichever team he's on. And the deal of Armstrong/Hedberg/3rd for Kennedy/Caputi/4th is very fair to both teams.

At least it's better than UFA Gill and UFA Sykora for Armstrong and Hedberg yeah, but I still wouldn't do it, especially given the terms an offer that couldn't be refused. This would be very forced as Pit has little need for Armstrong as there are plenty of "character" guys and a need for a backup goalie IMO isn't worth forcing a trade and giving up one of your highest prospects (Caputi) and a guy that has consistently gotten better (Kennedy).

**charlio lemieux** · 06-30-2009, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Where's Bure?

Wow, that is one heck of a trade. Well thought out. Geez, who doesn't that work out for? As a Pit fan I really do see the point of the trade. I love Malkin and it'd be hard to part with him, but he does bring to the table the same attributes as Crosby. And after this year, his value would be at an all-time high, so I think what he brought to the Pens in this trade is warranted – which is A LOT. Brown goes beyond his skill, Johnson is better than Goligoski (although I don't have much fact to base that on), Heatley is elite winger who would challenge Ovechkin for goals on Crosby's line, and Volchenkov is just under Orpik IMO, although if there was another player in the league to replace his style of play he's it.

That being said, I think the 3-headed monster in Pit with Crosby, Malkin, and Staal centering three different lines is a big reason for their success.

But as far as the trade goes, I feel Pit is receiving and giving away fairly even value. Now IMO I don't think Ott gave up enough to get Kopitar, Frolov, and Goligoski and I think the Kings gave up too much in Brown, Kopitar, Frolov, J. Johnson. Heatley wants out, and that leaves Ott's GM with less value than Heatley would normally have – add to that he had a season below his standards. Maybe Ott takes back their 1st, gives back Frolov, and gives a 3rd conditional – both to the Kings.

Actually I should edit that post to remove PIT 2nd to the Kings.

The Kings are giving up a lot but they are getting back one of the three best young players in the game. To get that you have to give a lot, especially when you consider Malkin is still 3-4 years away from just entering his prime. LA is dying for another Dionne or Gretzky type marquis player out there and Malkin is it. Plus they get OTT's 1st which goes along way to covering Frolov and making up the difference between Orpik and Johnson. I don't know about you but as much as I like Kopitar and Brown, both of them straight up for Malkin is a deal I couldn't refuse from LA's point of view.

IF Heatley didn't want out of OTT this deal would never even have come to mind. I think it also would have taken Volchenkov out of the equation in favour of a 3rd. So I did try to take that into account.
As it stands I would think Heatley would get Kopitar and a 2nd maybe from LA. Only problem is LA won't want to part with their #1 center. Malkin gives them that center, to not only replace Kopitar but one who is a serious improvment.
You have to remember also that Johnson's value to LA is not at it's peak right now. He needs a new contract and has already been mentioned in trade rumors mainly due to the play of Drew Doughty.

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