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Whatever. You're comparing Higgins to Henrik Sedin, one the highest assist getters in the league since the lockout? Give it all the time you want, Higgins will never be as good.
Maybe the Kaststysins will match the Sedins in another couple of seasons, but what good does that do Sundin now?
The Habs have a lot of small, skilled forwards that play a great perimeter game. Think back to last year's playoffs...were the Habs forwards blocking a lot of shots? Were they getting to the middle of the ice with any consistency? With the adding Bernier, Johnson and Hordichuk to a group that already includes Kesler, Burrows and Pyatt, the Canucks have much better balance.
Take a look at the centre group. Who would you take?
Henrik Sedin, Sundin, Kesler and Johnson or Koivu, Sundin, Higgins and Begin?
Looks pretty close to me.
Look at Vancouver's group with Demitra and Sundin added. Tell if anything's missing from that group. Now do the same thing with Montreal's group.
The point is, Montreal isn't that much closer to a Stanley Cup than Vancouver is. Certainly not the way most people seem to think.
Now, if the Habs added Sundin, that's different of course. But I don't think his chances in Montreal are any greater than they are in Vancouver.
The only real question is, does 20 million dollars outweigh the goeographical concerns to Mats and his family?
I still can't believe you are comparing the offense of one of the highest scoring team in the league to one of the lowest.
Not to mention that Van lost their second line center and winger.
Now as far as being cup contenders I don't really put either in that category.
I heard Berger say that on the Fan590 this morning, I also read that rotowire has Sundin all but signed in Montreal.
So it all depends on who you want to believe.
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Pardon my ignorance, but what's "rotowire"???
Quote:
Originally Posted by gordfish
Other than the geography, I don't get what the big deal about Montreal is.
Yes, they have better scoring depth than Vancouver at the moment, but add Sundin and Demitra to the Canucks and that changes things a lot. And I'd argue that Vancouver's forward group would have much better balance, as it would be bigger and tougher than Montreal's.
Daniel / Henrik / Bernier
Raymond / Sundin / Demitra
Burrows / Kesler / Pyatt
Hordichuk / Johnson / Pettinger
Wellwood, Cowan
As long as the Canucks D stays healthy, it's deeper and and at least as well balanced as what the Habs have. Although I'll grant Markov is the best scorer of the bunch. And Gillis isn't done adding to his group, as rumours suggest he is courting Nashville's Koistinen.
Certainly without Sundin, Montreal's forward group is slightly deeper, but strictly on paper there isn't a huge difference between the two rosters.
Montreal scored 262 goals last year, best in the league, while the Canucks only scored 213, good for 23rd in the NHL. Some will rightfully point out that Montreal had the best PP unit in the league and that, for two years running, but the Habs' still rank 9th in the NHL at even strength with 154 goals to the Canucks' 134 (24th in the league). The PP being such a huge part of the game, Sundin would be on the first PP unit for sure, most likely at the point with Markov feeding him the puck... Pretty darn tempting for an offensive player.
As for the defense and goaltending, Montreal only allowed 7 more goals for the entire season, or the equivalent of 0.08 goal per game. The offensive scoring 49 more goals or 0.6 goals per game, it's a differentials ratio of +0.52 goals per game for the Habs, the difference between 3rd overall to 21st.
In addition, Vancouver lost their second best goals' scorer, 3rd points getter and team captain and replaced him with Steve Bernier. Montreal replaced Ryder with Tanguay, a huge improvement. They picked up Laraque who will make every Habs' player feel 3" and 15 lbs bigger.
All in all, you'll be hardpressed to convince anyone, Canucks' fans included, that the Canucks have a comparable team to Montreal, sorry.
__________________ "Too bad for Mats, he could have been playing here" ~ Robert Lang.
I still can't believe you are comparing the offense of one of the highest scoring team in the league to one of the lowest.
Not to mention that Van lost their second line center and winger.
Now as far as being cup contenders I don't really put either in that category.
morrison played 39 games last year.... so I really dont get why everyone keeps talking about how much we lost.... and im thinkin maybe just maybe demitra might be able to create a little more offense if or when he signs.... i heard 3 years 12 million on team 1040, and with our cap room we could still sign sundin.... and how many teams are over the cap?? 7 or something like that?? gotta dump salary somewhere!! and how many eastern teams are willing to give up a top 6 forward for defense, i'd say maybe just a few HAH! i'd say canucks have maybe just one or two solid defenseman lol... its only july people we got lots of time.... or should we panic and go sign ryder for 4 mill a year??!! hahahaha
Morrison's departure, coupled with Naslund's last Thursday, puts further pressure on Gillis to land reluctant superstar Mats Sundin.
The 37-year-old Swede is sitting on a massive $10-million-a-season offer from Gillis. Sundin can choose either a one- or two-year proposal.
Meanwhile, Canuck defenceman Mattias Ohlund said he is ready to pump up Vancouver should Sundin require any additional information on the team or city. Ohlund is now the longest serving Canuck with Trevor Linden and Naslund both gone.
"If Mats calls, trust me I will put in a good word for the team," Ohlund chuckled Monday from his summer home in northern Sweden. "I haven't spoken to him or the Canucks or anybody regarding him. Maybe I should call him. I don't know if it would help or not. I guess it couldn't hurt."
Ohlund and Sundin are hardly strangers. They have played together internationally numerous times, most recently on Sweden's gold-medal winning 2006 Olympic team.
They share the same agent, J.P. Barry, so the lines of communication should be open. Barry also represents the Sedin twins. The Canucks' courting of Sundin is major news in Sweden.
"Mats Sundin is one of the biggest hockey players our country has had in the last 15 years along with Peter Forsberg and Nicklas Lidstrom," Ohlund said. "So whatever he does gets pretty big headlines over here. He's been one of the best players in the NHL for a lot of years. It would obviously be a big, big boost for us.
"He's shown, even at age 37, he can still play at a very high level. It should be interesting to see what happens."
Montreal scored 262 goals last year, best in the league, while the Canucks only scored 213, good for 23rd in the NHL. Some will rightfully point out that Montreal had the best PP unit in the league and that, for two years running, but the Habs' still rank 9th in the NHL at even strength with 154 goals to the Canucks' 134 (24th in the league). The PP being such a huge part of the game, Sundin would be on the first PP unit for sure, most likely at the point with Markov feeding him the puck... Pretty darn tempting for an offensive player.
As for the defense and goaltending, Montreal only allowed 7 more goals for the entire season, or the equivalent of 0.08 goal per game. The offensive scoring 49 more goals or 0.6 goals per game, it's a differentials ratio of +0.52 goals per game for the Habs, the difference between 3rd overall to 21st.
In addition, Vancouver lost their second best goals' scorer, 3rd points getter and team captain and replaced him with Steve Bernier. Montreal replaced Ryder with Tanguay, a huge improvement. They picked up Laraque who will make every Habs' player feel 3" and 15 lbs bigger.
All in all, you'll be hardpressed to convince anyone, Canucks' fans included, that the Canucks have a comparable team to Montreal, sorry.
You're comparing last season's rosters. I'm talking about the current rosters with Sundin added.
Vancouver would have better balance and a much better chance at a long playoff run than Montreal.
Should Sundin sign, he joins a team that would have two 20 goal scorers on their third line in Kesler and Pyatt and a 20 goal scorer on their fourth line in Pettinger. And Kyle Wellood as a depth forward.
Would they score as much as Montreal? In a tighter, more physical Western Conference? Probably not. But with a healthy year from their defense and a bounce back season from Luongo, they wouldn't have to.
I posed the question, and I'll ask it again. With Demitra and Sundin signed, what don't the Canucks have among their forward group?
You want goals? 30 from Daniel, Sundin and possible Demitra. 20 from Kesler, Pyatt, Wellwood and possibly Pettinger, if he gets the ice time. 15 from Henrik and Burrows, and upwards of 15 from Raymond and Bernier, who both have the skill to threaten the 30 mark themselves.
Playmakers? Henrik has been amongst the league leaders in assits since the lockout. Sundin, Daniel and Demitra are no slouches in that area, either. And there is Wellwood for depth.
You want speed? Raymond, Kesler and Johnson bring it.
Size? How about Bernier, Sundin, Pyatt, Hordichuk and Cowan? And Johnson and Demitra are certainly no smurfs.
Grit and energy? Burrows, Hordichuk, Cowan, Pettinger, Rypien, Brown.
Shot blockers? Johnson leads the league for forwards.
Face-offs? Sundin, Kesler, Johnson, Wellwood.
In Montreal, you get scoring, and with the exception of Higgins and Laraque, that's pretty much it.
You're comparing last season's rosters. I'm talking about the current rosters with Sundin added.
Vancouver would have better balance and a much better chance at a long playoff run than Montreal.
You can't add Sundin to Vancouver and not add him with Montreal in your comparisons in saying that Vancouver with Sundin is better than Montreal without him!
Also, in all due respect, I don't think that you've looked at the Montreal line-up as of late and are basing your opinion on the Habs of a few years ago. Off our regular roster, we only have 4 guys under 6'0 (one of them Bouillon and he's almost 200 lbs) and only 3 under 190 lbs (one of them being Begin and we know how he plays)...
The Mats Sundin watch...
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